For more on this topic, check out
this article on Information Week.
Evidently, Microsoft just booted up to a million people off of Xbox Live. The reason? Mod-chipping.
For those who do not know, modding is installing any piece of third-party hardware into the Xbox. People do this for a variety of reasons, from wanting to cheat to wanting to play backups of their video games. Custom Xboxes are also considered "modded." It is a relatively easy process, though it voids your warranty. When I originally got my Xbox 360, I was seriously contemplating modding it the same way I did my original Xbox – basically removing the DRM protection to allow me to play backed up copies of my video games. I had no malicious intent to distribute or illegally obtain copies (as a student studying to one day make these sorts of games, I know the harm that illegal downloading can cause), but I did want to be able to play backed-up copies of my own video games.
On my original Xbox, most of my games were stored away until the copy broke, then I would simply burn a new one if I wanted to play it. This action saved me hundreds of dollars over the course of my gaming lifetime with my Xbox since I have two little brothers and a cat who likes shiny objects.
Now, I'm glad I was too lazy to mod my Xbox 360. Microsoft just banned between 600,000 to 1,000,000 systems from Xbox Live.
Here's the kicker though. They didn't ban the gamertags associated with those Xboxes, they banned the actual box. What this means is that more than likely, some kid who got banned is going to wind up charged every pay period for an account he can't use unless he goes and buys a new Xbox.
Even worse, all the Halo addicts and kids who just bought Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 who can't stomach the thought of solo play will have to get new Xboxes as well.
Back when Halo 2 was released, rampant cheating caused Bungie (the developers) to pass a patch that did something similar. If you had modified content (maps, skins, cheats, hacks, etc.) pertaining to Halo 2, the ban hammer struck down on you. However, that patch only detected Halo 2 content that was hacked. It did not actually detect modchips, as far as I remember. This new update actually scans your Xbox and will ban you for anything that makes it considered modded.
What do you think of the situation? Is it fair? Should you be banned just for having mod chips?
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Comments (63)
This is poppy cock!
I think most if not all kids don't have auto renew on xbox live, especially since they are kids they probably go out and buy the prepaid card. You can always call them to cancel too. But on topic, I think people should be banned for modding, its not good to steal or get games for free like that. People work hard on making games, you might not have the money but people shouldn't lose out on their hard work. Props to taking the piracy countermeasures up a notch.
Well, those people violated Microsoft's terms of service. They have a right to enforce their rules. I can see it would suck if you bought a card for Xbox Live because now you are out the rest of your money (I assume if you pay on a credit card you can just cancel and get your money back for what is left?). The rules probably suck, but that doesn't mean they don't get to enforce them.
Hmm. My boyfriend has a modded Xbox, he gets his games for free/cheap...hope he doesn't get banned, he will probably cry. Xbox is his life. lol.
The people who modded their Xbox consoles to play pirated games, then downloaded pirated games, then had the nerve to play those pirated games on Xbox's own online system, are darned lucky that swinging the ban hammer is ALL Microsoft did.
I don't know any who has banned for this, In my placement where I used to work two of my team mates had X Boxs I wonder whether their have be banned.
I think a warning+ultamatum (ex: "You modded. Get rid of that shit in a week or ban hammer") would have been a little better, but hey, if you void the warranty and such...
bullshit. I bet you played illegal copies.
I have mixed feelings on this.
On one hand, I think it is wrong to ban their boxes and not accounts. It's a cheap way to milk money. If you're going to ban something, ban it all. It also bothers me that they marginalize modding your box. Once you've bought it, it's your property. Do whatever you want with it, but the console manufacturers have been known to prosecute people for doing so.
On the other hand, these modded boxes are used to cheat, and they cheat a lot. I don't like cheaters, and that's something I've enjoyed about XBL: cheating isn't as prevalent as it is in PC gaming. Also, XBL is a service. You aren't guaranteed to have it, and if you get caught, the ban hammer comes down on you. I kind of like this for the reasons stated about cheating.
Voiding the warranty is enough. People can easily report hackers and they can have their accounts disabled. Having back-up games that you already have ownership of is perfectly reasonable. Then it just comes down to the piracy aspect.
Any kind of modding? I know a guy who modded his console and all he did was change the color of the outside. Does that count? Can they even detect that....?
@black_lie@xanga - It's not aimed at that. It's aimed at modifying the circuitry on the 360 so that it can play back-up DVDs, pirated DVDs, and eliminate region-locks. What you're describing isn't targeted, and it couldn't be detected.
If it's in the Terms of Agreement that you can't modify the Xbox, of course it's fair.
Makes me wonder if my XBOX is considered "modded" ... I replaced the XClamps with nuts and bolts to fix the Red Ring of Death.
Yes, it's fair. It sucks, but it's fair.
never knew that many xbox systems are banned...
I'm surprised theres that many smart modders out there to get banned...This is a genius move, and something that people will just find a way to get around eventually, fornuately or unfornuately.
This is basically what happens with PSP, just not automatically, bricking a system for detectable mods, and of course it was gotten around. Wonder if xbox does more to the sake of enforcement, or to make more money by selling more systems...
Or they want as many complaints as the DMV, who knows ^^
Thats bullshit.
We live in an electronic world and Microsoft is just trying to put limits on the limitless possibilities we have.
it's completely fair.
@TheModernBunny@xanga - agreed. these kids could get in so much worse trouble, easily, but they cry about their xbox getting banned. there are people out there who are caught illegally downloading free music, and have had to pay thousands of dollars for it. from what I understand of this post, Microsoft simply scans through the xboxes to find mods, and bans the modded xboxes. they don't take the time out to pick out what exactly these individuals have done, so they end up getting the games for free and never having to pay the money for them...
@AllthePerfect_Words@xanga - seriously? all the people who create video games go through some intense schooling (not intense as in a lot of years, but just intense to where most gamers probably don't realize how much work is put into making a game) and then when they're out in the real world actually making games for Infinity Ward or whoever, they slave over all the work that needs to be done. there are so many people who put so much work into these games, and it isn't fair for greedy ass gamers to steal away a game when they did absolutely NOTHING to deserve a free game. it's ignorant to think that it's bullshit, especially when it's listed in their terms & conditions... without Microsoft having ever existed, you wouldn't have HALF the electronic shit that's produced in this world, so don't try to say that they're putting unfair limits on us when they're the ones who even supply us with this stuff. in fact, if no electronic companies ever existed to this day, we'd be living with nearly NOTHING. and then you wouldn't even know what a video game WAS. how about that? how about we all be grateful video games and other electronics even exist?
@TheModernBunny@xanga - I wouldn't be surprised if Microsoft is lining some lawsuits up myself; Piracy is a bad habit, but the laws are changing constantly, and I believe that companies, for better or for worse, are going to have the upper hand in the legal field. The problem is that this creates animosity, really, and will only result in more piracy, I think. For this reason, I really do expect Microsoft to start handing out a few lawsuits in the coming weeks.
@cutesycharm@xanga - I know I can't prove it, but I assure you, I really never have pirated any xbox games. You are legally allowed to have ONE working copy of your software, provided that if you sell the original or if it is destroyed, that the copy that you own is either sold with it (without charge) or you destroy it as well. I would appreciate you not calling me a liar, though, i suppose I'm in the position of looking like one.
@Takingthe38th@xanga - Entirely true - I've found that, generally, the reputation system has always worked. If I disliked a player, it took maybe five seconds to give negative feedback; hacking gives them an account flag anyway...the question is, with an /automated/ system, how do you separate the people who legitimately copy games from those who simply torrent the iso files and play them. Not that opponents online can tell the difference in order TO leave that kind of feedback, but the question remains. The only implementation I can possibly think of is the CD-KEY system that PC's have adopted. Of course, this wouldn't work very well on a console, as it doesn't even work well on PC's. A good example would be back when the original Xbox was still in sizable numbers, I once had an instance where I bought a subscription of Xbox Live but someone had already used the key on it through use of a keygen. (I would assume) However, after a phone call and following the instructions of the techie on the phone, the fraudulent Xbox Live account was removed and I was allowed to play. Without mediation of the human techie, this wouldn't work though - I would simply have been "Banned" as a fraudulent account, not the real cheater.
@black_lie@xanga - provided your friend did not actually tamper with the hardware on the inside of the box, they can't really detect it, since its more-or-less a cosmetic change. However, if his console should ever get Red Rings, Microsoft will basically send him a big fuck you, or a nice bill for his repair.
@canicus@xanga - I can see both arguments, really. But I believe that what you're saying begs the question: When you buy something digitally, do you own it? Anyone who purchases their games off of Steam (where I get the majority of my games) could take a look at the old Terms of Service for Steam, which originally made me question the intentions of Valve. Thankfully, they updated them, but just recently as about two years ago, if you read closely, you could see that they left room to make Steam itself a pay-for, monthly service, which would mean you would have to pay just to access games you already bought, supposedly that you owned.
@AllthePerfect_Words@xanga - Ahh, my friend, if we only lived in a perfect, open source world. The problems we faced would be so much less...annoying. Hahaha. The possibilities are indeed limitless. It's just that Open Source won't pay the bills. That said...I appreciate your sentiments. =]
@Icecold4u@xanga - I would be leaning toward the money side of things myself, just for the timing of the update (right after Modern Warfare 2 was released) though I would hardly think to call any modder who had the nerve to connect to Xbox Live (or any internet service) "Smart." - As a rule of thumb, if you're using it on the internet, you can be found. The question is, is should a company be able to find out, without your permission.
@shunny@xanga - these were just the initial bannings, but the number is not official as of yet. Microsoft claims many more are on the way.
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For those interested, I suggest checking out the program "Steam" via www.steampowered.com, and check for some info on their proprietary banning system known as VAC (Valve Anti-Cheat), and maybe comment on that as well.
Steam is a digital distribution platform, and is sort of the iTunes of PC gaming, though it overcomes many of the failures of iTunes by nature. (PC games aren't very portable, really, and CDKeys can't be used simultaneously) VAC is very prominently advertised and will perma-ban your account if you have any modifications to the core game files. Like this XBox banning, the only way to fix it is to sign up for a new steam account and rebuy your games. The difference that makes their argument work and makes Microsofts break is that Steam has always said: "It's not a question of /if/ VAC catches you, because it WILL catch you. VAC bans are permanent. You will not be able to play online, AT ALL, once you are VAC Banned. Sorry. You're out of luck."
@LOVEdrunkxDollyBlueQuen@xanga - Said with the edge of a true sage. I find thoughts and comments are most effective when accomplished in five words or less, much unlike this one I'm posting now.
As far as things go with this banning business, I don't think I know enough things to say stuff except:
Sucks.
@GodaiTheRonin@xanga - @scrambledmegsntoast@xanga - I was going to reply to these in my massmessage but it got cleared when I was finding that steam website. Forgot to reclick the names.
You both deal with the same subject of Xbox Live in terms of renewal. My experience (This is to Godai) is that, actually, more people are on a renewal basis - it's the default setting even when you buy timecards - since you still need credit card verification. I wound up extremely angry with Microsoft when my original Xbox Live timecard renewed itself after a year, even though I already had an Xbox 360 as well as a 360 Live Account. They gave a refund but it was hard fought. I usually scan through fine print pretty hard and was shocked that I somehow missed the renewal settings. That or they worded it to the point where I didn't understand what they were asking about and just clicked "next."
As for Megs, this might sound contradictory to what I just said, but there is indeed a pretty hard no-refund policy on timecards. Once it is purchased, the sale is final. A friend of mine bought a timecard while he bought MW2 at the midnight release. (He was planning this for a while, to start playing on Live when he got MW2) - He bought a one year subscription, but due to his modchip which allowed him to install Linux to his xbox, which he did "for fun." After a single night of fragging on MW2 he got banhammered.
He still wants to keep the modded one though, cause he thinks: "its just too fucking cool.", though he is buying a new one soon.
I think it's fair.